Not yet a member?

    Popular Topics
    Search


    Forums
  • Forums
  • Ask a question about:

    Our Supporters
    Syndication
    Subscribe

Too Good to Be True? Let’s Check What’s Really Possible!


May 30, 2010 - 12:09 pm     Print This Post Print This Post     view / write comments

1 Star2 Stars3 Stars4 Stars5 Stars (2 votes, average: 5.00 out of 5)
Loading ... Loading ...
Dr West

GRACE member DonnaS raised a very common and appropriate question (see thread here) about why we don’t more routinely recommend procedures like radiation or radiofrequency ablation, or surgery for people with metastatic cancer, especially if there are advertisements from various centers extolling the virtues of their new techniques for helping people potentially achieve better results than ever thought possible, possibly even a cure when others had said this wasn’t possible.

I’ll admit that these advertisements have been a real pet peeve of mine because I think they take advantage of people’s need for hope and potential desperation.  If your oncologist tells you that your metastatic lung cancer isn’t curable and a nearby cancer center runs a newspaper advertisement that describes a testimonial of a patient who seemingly defied the odds by pursuing their institution’s cutting edge technology, shouldn’t this lead you to question your oncologist, pick up the phone, and try to sign up?

People shouldn’t blindly accept conventional wisdom, and in fact there are certainly people with advanced lung cancer who have done remarkably well and even appear to be cured years after diagnosis (described in part by the concept of the “precocious metastasis” (summarized, and discussed in podcast).  In fact, there are even studies that are beginning to study the question of whether it is feasible to treat people with minimal residual viable disease with curative intent.

It’s not that individual cases don’t merit very personalized decision-making, and most of us who work in cancer care have come to appreciate that almost anything is possible.  The problem is that mass-marketing these possibilities is misleading, and I suspect a mechanism to maximize profit by extending an expensive intervention to a market of both people who are reasonable as well as much less appropriate candidates for these approaches (although they will certainly be limited to people who can pay for them, either themselves or through insurance — they aren’t being done as charity care).

All of us would love to learn about successes for the people who defy the odds and highlight what is possible.  However, we don’t want to be manipulated by institutions or companies that are duping people into pursuing futile treatments.  So I’m going to request that people please add in the comments here, or in an e-mail to me at west@cancergrace.org, any internet links or details of contact information for places that are making claims that don’t seem to jibe with what you’re hearing here about standards of care and might seem to be improbably optimistic, if not quite too good to be true.

Whether it’s a radiation approach, radiofrequency ablation, new surgery, investigational agent, or novel test that promises things that we haven’t extolled here, I’d love to chase  down as much truth as I can find from the sources.  I’ll be eager to relate any information I can get about the the success stories — and we can all probably learn from what makes them success stories — as well as the possible sobering reality that many of these advertisements are actually delivering false promises.

Let’s shine some light here and see what we find.  I’ve had enough of patients being preyed upon based on desperation, but if I’m wrong, people here should learn of the successes of the places that are setting themselves apart.

No related posts.

Related posts brought to you by Yet Another Related Posts Plugin.

Posted in: Cancer Treatments, General Print This Post Print This Post


  1. May 30, 2010 - 12:55 pm

    A recent acquaintance proclaimed herself cancer free from triple negative breast cancer based on seeing this doctor, as well as getting a custom vaccine made for her by some scientist in Redmond. http://www.drforsythe.com/ I believe she also took some standard chemo, but her belief is in the alternative treatments she received. Looks like he is staying away from lung cancer - no links or supplements. So maybe this isn’t a good start.

    ts
  2. May 30, 2010 - 1:28 pm

    Ok, here’s one that’s close to home:

    http://www.king5.com/health/cancer-free-washington/Cyber-knife-surgery–92353094.html

    Do cyberknife patients really have an 80% survival rate at three years? It sounds majorly attractive to me since my first and secondline treatments have failed and it’s not clear that I will qualify for the ALK clinical trials.

    reginac
  3. May 30, 2010 - 8:23 pm

    Thank you Dr. West for addressing my question regarding treatment. I am in California and City of Hope is where everyone strives to go for cutting edge treatment. They are an NCI designated comprehensive cancer center. Their print ads state “if you’ve been diagnosed with lung cancer, trust your life to City of Hope”. They were named one of America’s best cancer hospitals by U.S. News & World Report. It just makes me feel that if I don’t get my husband in to see them, I an not doing all I can do to help him.

    I also contacted Dr. Stanislaw Burzynski as a result of reading Suzanne Sommer’s book, Knockout. Unfortunately, the cost was thousands of dollars and they don’t take Medicare. Out of our reach.

    That has been our experience thus far. As we stand now, we will continue with the treatment recommended by our oncologist. But….you just can’t help but wonder.

    DonnaS

    DonnaS
  4. May 30, 2010 - 10:25 pm

    These are all good suggestions, and I suspect just the tip of the iceberg. I must say that it wouldn’t blow my mind to find that my own institution could be contributing to the arms race of implausible technology-fueled promises. However, I’d like to chase down advertising as a first priority and then handle media puff pieces as a separate question (but certainly leading to obscene oversimplification of complex issues). That said, I won’t shy away from addressing any dubious claims made from the marketing side of my own institution. I think it’s offensive no matter who is doing it.

    And I’m definitely interested in chasing down these other leads, and any others that people want to suggest, and providing a summary of what I can learn.

    Dr West
  5. May 31, 2010 - 8:36 am

    Here’s an article from the NY Times showing that even the top cancers are not immune from this kind of exaggeration: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/19/health/19cancerads.html?_r=1

    And personally, if I never see another Cancer Treatment Centers of America TV ad again I will be happy. They use as examples the worst experiences with an oncologist or cancer center that anyone could possibly have, compare them with the caring treatment they received at CTCA and try to convince us that’s what made the difference in their survival. By implication, we are led to believe that any doctor who tells you that your cancer is incurable is not doing enough for you.

    I have too much personal experience with very caring oncologists, including the GRACE doctors, who are frustrated by the lack of treatment options and only wish that they didn’t need to use that word “incurable” when counseling their patients.

    Jim

    JimC
  6. May 31, 2010 - 9:10 am

    Then there’s Dr. Nicholas Gonzalez:

    http://www.dr-gonzalez.com/research.htm

    I have said to many that the plural of anecdote is not data. Even that statement is not well accepted by some.

    reginac
  7. May 31, 2010 - 11:46 am

    Jim, you beat me to it but I’ll add the site ad for cancer centers of America.

    http://www.cancercenter.com/landing-pages/cancer/

    They pray on our lack of knowledge coming in to our cancer situations and make you believe that this is “the” place if only you could afford it. One of the first, maybe the first thread I read on this site was about cancer centers of Am. Thanks Dr. West you calmed my mind then and you’ve taken on quite a crusade here.

    catdander
  8. June 1, 2010 - 5:10 am

    Dr. West
    This is a superb initiative :-).
    My contribution would be to keep my post about my husband’s case updated through the chemoradiation course laid out over the coming 7 weeks. Our hospital is funded by tax money, they are treating him out of ambition to see if they should change their general attitude in oligometastatic cases.

    kej
  9. June 14, 2010 - 3:06 pm

    Hi.
    I noticed there was an ASCO 2010 abstract concerning radiation for oligometastatic disease.
    Did any of you participants have a chance to learn more about this?

    kej
  10. June 14, 2010 - 4:59 pm

    I don’t recall it: it certainly wasn’t a high profile presentation. Can you give me the number and/or first author?

    Dr West
  11. June 15, 2010 - 3:50 pm

    Dr. West -

    Not sure if this relates to the study to which Kej referred regarding radiation for oligometastatic disease, but it might provide some direction:
    http://jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/content/abstract/27/10/1579

    Here’s an editorial on the topic (it sounds familiar, so we might have discussed this before at GRACE):
    http://jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/content/full/27/10/1537

    - Catharine

    Catharine
  12. June 28, 2010 - 12:32 am

    Sorry for being so late in reacting to your question, Dr. West.

    Yes, thanks Catharine, I was indeed referring to
    http://jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/content/abstract/27/10/1579

    kej
  13. June 28, 2010 - 12:34 am

    Sorry,
    Thanks in advance

    kej
  14. June 28, 2010 - 9:35 am

    I’ve fallen behind but will try to give some answers on these questions. I’ll try chasing some down this week.

    Dr West
  15. June 28, 2010 - 10:31 am

    Looking at the full article from JCO (from the abstract ending in 1579), this trial didn’t really seem to address the issue of radiation treatment with curative intent in the context of oligometastatic disease. First, the primary endpoint was local control; survival and toxicity were only secondary endpoints. Also, in order to accrue enough participants, patients with less favorable characteristics (more than 3 thoracic lesions, extrathoracic disease, etc.) were enrolled. Most of the discussion of results centered on local control of the radiated lesions. So unless there were further results presented at ASCO 2010, this may not be the trial to provide helpful insight into the question of curative radiation treatment for oligometastatic lung cancer.

    Jim

    JimC
  16. August 2, 2010 - 7:31 am

    Thanks,
    What would your conclusion be concerning the success of local control?

    kej
  17. August 2, 2010 - 10:11 am

    kej,

    According to the abstract, the median follow-up was 15.4 months and “Actuarial local control at one and two years after SBRT was 100% and 96%, respectively. Local progression occurred in one patient, 13 months after SBRT. Median survival was 19 months.” So the specific lesions radiated were well-controlled, but the impact on survival is debatable (especially given the broad enrollment discussed above).

    Jim

    JimC
  18. August 2, 2010 - 10:26 am

    Jim and Dr. West
    I definitely see the enrollment issues.
    But still, a median survival of 19 months for a person with metastatic disease after having been through at least 1 treatment seems to me like a better outcome than we usually see for metastatic disease.

    kej